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	<title>Comments for Pasadena Politics</title>
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	<description>Politics aren't always rosey.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 03:53:35 -0700</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Coakley Demonstrates Great Ignorance of the Constitution. by Shannon Riojas</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2010/01/16/coakley-demonstrates-great-ignorance-of-the-constitution/comment-page-1/#comment-292</link>
		<dc:creator>Shannon Riojas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 03:53:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=210#comment-292</guid>
		<description>You do bring up a very good point concerning the requirement of laws to be followed by people of various religions.  It is one I constantly think about in our society where you have various sects which would impose their religious laws on all people: such as Shia Muslims who would impose very restrictive laws and are intolerant of other beliefs.  

Coakley&#039;s comment in the interview is specifically relating to contraception and the unspoken zinger: abortion (since we are talking about people visiting a hospital rather than their family planner, this assumption makes sense to me).  Contraception is not a life saving matter like heart surgery or even a medical necessity like fixing a broken leg.  Additionally, the Hippocratic oath doctors takes precludes them from refusing to help.  Including an exemption clause in any health care requirement with regards to contraception just makes sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You do bring up a very good point concerning the requirement of laws to be followed by people of various religions.  It is one I constantly think about in our society where you have various sects which would impose their religious laws on all people: such as Shia Muslims who would impose very restrictive laws and are intolerant of other beliefs.  </p>
<p>Coakley&#8217;s comment in the interview is specifically relating to contraception and the unspoken zinger: abortion (since we are talking about people visiting a hospital rather than their family planner, this assumption makes sense to me).  Contraception is not a life saving matter like heart surgery or even a medical necessity like fixing a broken leg.  Additionally, the Hippocratic oath doctors takes precludes them from refusing to help.  Including an exemption clause in any health care requirement with regards to contraception just makes sense.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Coakley Demonstrates Great Ignorance of the Constitution. by Doug Indeap</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2010/01/16/coakley-demonstrates-great-ignorance-of-the-constitution/comment-page-1/#comment-291</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug Indeap</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Jan 2010 21:43:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=210#comment-291</guid>
		<description>The phrase “separation of church and state” is but a metaphor to describe the underlying principle of the First Amendment and no-religious-test clause.  That the phrase does not appear in the text of the Constitution assumes much importance, it seems, only to those who may have once labored under the misimpression it was there and later learned otherwise.  To those familiar with the Constitution, the absence of the metaphor commonly used to describe one of its principles is no more consequential than the absence of other phrases (e.g., Bill of Rights, separation of powers, checks and balances, fair trial, religious liberty) used to describe other undoubted Constitutional principles. 

Some try to pass off the Supreme Court&#039;s decision in Everson v. Board of Education as simply a misreading of Jefferson&#039;s letter to the Danbury Baptists.  Instructive as that letter is, it played but a small part in the Court&#039;s decision.  It was only after reaching its conclusion based on a detailed discussion of the historical events leading to the First Amendment that the Court mentioned the letter.  The metaphor &quot;separation of church and state&quot; was but a handy catch phrase to describe the upshot of its conclusion.  The Court&#039;s reading of the First Amendment in this regard was unanimous; all nine Justices agreed on that much, but split 5-4 on whether the Amendment precludes states from paying for transportation of students to religious schools.  

Perhaps even more than Jefferson, Madison influenced the Court&#039;s view.  Madison, who had a central role in drafting the Constitution and the First Amendment, confirmed that he understood them to &quot;[s]trongly guard[] . . . the separation between Religion and Government.&quot;  Madison, Detached Memoranda (~1820).  He made plain, too, that they guarded against more than just laws creating state sponsored churches or imposing a state religion.  Mindful that old habits die hard and citizens and politicians could tend to entangle government and religion (e.g., &quot;the appointment of chaplains to the two houses of Congress&quot; and &quot;for the army and navy&quot; and &quot;[r]eligious proclamations by the Executive recommending thanksgivings and fasts&quot;), he considered the question whether such actions were &quot;consistent with the Constitution, and with the pure principle of religious freedom&quot; and responded:  &quot;In strictness the answer on both points must be in the negative.  The Constitution of the United States forbids everything like an establishment of a national religion.&quot;

You also argue that the government should not require people to do things contrary to their faith.  The government could hardly operate if anyone could opt out of laws with the excuse that their religion requires or allows it.  The courts have confronted this sort of issue and have ruled that the government cannot enact laws specifically aimed at a particular religion, but if the government enacts laws generally applicable to everyone or at least broad classes of people (e.g, laws concerning traffic, pollution, taxes, contracts, fraud, negligence), it can require everyone, including those who may object on religious grounds, to abide by them. 
 
In rare (one hopes) circumstances, such a generally-applicable law could put an individual in an ethical Catch-22 if it requires one to take actions one considers immoral.  This potential dilemma is not peculiar to any particular religion.  Anyone--Christian, atheist, etc.--may be put in such a bind.  For just this reason, when such binds can be anticipated, provisions may be added to laws affording some relief to conscientious objectors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The phrase “separation of church and state” is but a metaphor to describe the underlying principle of the First Amendment and no-religious-test clause.  That the phrase does not appear in the text of the Constitution assumes much importance, it seems, only to those who may have once labored under the misimpression it was there and later learned otherwise.  To those familiar with the Constitution, the absence of the metaphor commonly used to describe one of its principles is no more consequential than the absence of other phrases (e.g., Bill of Rights, separation of powers, checks and balances, fair trial, religious liberty) used to describe other undoubted Constitutional principles. </p>
<p>Some try to pass off the Supreme Court&#8217;s decision in Everson v. Board of Education as simply a misreading of Jefferson&#8217;s letter to the Danbury Baptists.  Instructive as that letter is, it played but a small part in the Court&#8217;s decision.  It was only after reaching its conclusion based on a detailed discussion of the historical events leading to the First Amendment that the Court mentioned the letter.  The metaphor &#8220;separation of church and state&#8221; was but a handy catch phrase to describe the upshot of its conclusion.  The Court&#8217;s reading of the First Amendment in this regard was unanimous; all nine Justices agreed on that much, but split 5-4 on whether the Amendment precludes states from paying for transportation of students to religious schools.  </p>
<p>Perhaps even more than Jefferson, Madison influenced the Court&#8217;s view.  Madison, who had a central role in drafting the Constitution and the First Amendment, confirmed that he understood them to &#8220;[s]trongly guard[] . . . the separation between Religion and Government.&#8221;  Madison, Detached Memoranda (~1820).  He made plain, too, that they guarded against more than just laws creating state sponsored churches or imposing a state religion.  Mindful that old habits die hard and citizens and politicians could tend to entangle government and religion (e.g., &#8220;the appointment of chaplains to the two houses of Congress&#8221; and &#8220;for the army and navy&#8221; and &#8220;[r]eligious proclamations by the Executive recommending thanksgivings and fasts&#8221;), he considered the question whether such actions were &#8220;consistent with the Constitution, and with the pure principle of religious freedom&#8221; and responded:  &#8220;In strictness the answer on both points must be in the negative.  The Constitution of the United States forbids everything like an establishment of a national religion.&#8221;</p>
<p>You also argue that the government should not require people to do things contrary to their faith.  The government could hardly operate if anyone could opt out of laws with the excuse that their religion requires or allows it.  The courts have confronted this sort of issue and have ruled that the government cannot enact laws specifically aimed at a particular religion, but if the government enacts laws generally applicable to everyone or at least broad classes of people (e.g, laws concerning traffic, pollution, taxes, contracts, fraud, negligence), it can require everyone, including those who may object on religious grounds, to abide by them. </p>
<p>In rare (one hopes) circumstances, such a generally-applicable law could put an individual in an ethical Catch-22 if it requires one to take actions one considers immoral.  This potential dilemma is not peculiar to any particular religion.  Anyone&#8211;Christian, atheist, etc.&#8211;may be put in such a bind.  For just this reason, when such binds can be anticipated, provisions may be added to laws affording some relief to conscientious objectors.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Our Dear Leader by Posts about Barack Obama as of September 25, 2009 &#187; The Daily Parr</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2009/09/25/our-dear-leader/comment-page-1/#comment-207</link>
		<dc:creator>Posts about Barack Obama as of September 25, 2009 &#187; The Daily Parr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Sep 2009 02:37:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=176#comment-207</guid>
		<description>[...] to cross the line from heated talk to dangerous actions. My initial response is “well, duh”.   Our Dear Leader &#8211; pasadenapolitics.net 09/26/2009 September 25th, 2009 Goto commentsLeave a comment I [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] to cross the line from heated talk to dangerous actions. My initial response is “well, duh”.   Our Dear Leader &#8211; pasadenapolitics.net 09/26/2009 September 25th, 2009 Goto commentsLeave a comment I [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Two Plus Two Equals Five. by Two Plus Two Equals Five. &#124; Fashion AutoCar Mobile Motor Modification</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2009/09/25/two-plus-two-equals-five/comment-page-1/#comment-206</link>
		<dc:creator>Two Plus Two Equals Five. &#124; Fashion AutoCar Mobile Motor Modification</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Sep 2009 01:39:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=173#comment-206</guid>
		<description>[...] Two Plus Two Equals Five.   Filed under: Uncategorized Tags: a-tax-increase-, america, auto car, now-everybody, oil-market-, [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Two Plus Two Equals Five.   Filed under: Uncategorized Tags: a-tax-increase-, america, auto car, now-everybody, oil-market-, [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Does President Obama support Freedom? by Pasadena Politics &#187; Spell bound with power</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2009/07/06/does-president-obama-support-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-205</link>
		<dc:creator>Pasadena Politics &#187; Spell bound with power</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Sep 2009 03:11:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=155#comment-205</guid>
		<description>[...] while back I wrote about Obama and wondered if he supports freedom.   Well, given the pressure Washington has been putting on [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] while back I wrote about Obama and wondered if he supports freedom.   Well, given the pressure Washington has been putting on [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on The title should have been &#8220;2009&#8243; and not &#8220;1984&#8243; by Gerald Ford &#124; All Days Long</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2009/08/03/the-title-should-have-been-2009-and-not-1984/comment-page-1/#comment-204</link>
		<dc:creator>Gerald Ford &#124; All Days Long</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Aug 2009 07:23:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=161#comment-204</guid>
		<description>[...]  Pasadena Politics » The title should have been “2009″ and not “1984″  By Shannon Riojas  With all the talk about National Health Care in America, one should keep close in mind these very appropriate words: “A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.” -Gerald Ford &#8230;   Pasadena Politics &#8211; http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/ [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...]  Pasadena Politics » The title should have been “2009″ and not “1984″  By Shannon Riojas  With all the talk about National Health Care in America, one should keep close in mind these very appropriate words: “A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.” -Gerald Ford &#8230;   Pasadena Politics &#8211; <a href="http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/" rel="nofollow">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Does President Obama support Freedom? by Pasadena Politics » Does President Obama support Freedom? &#124; Cuba today</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2009/07/06/does-president-obama-support-freedom/comment-page-1/#comment-203</link>
		<dc:creator>Pasadena Politics » Does President Obama support Freedom? &#124; Cuba today</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Jul 2009 10:53:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=155#comment-203</guid>
		<description>[...] See the rest here: Pasadena Politics » Does President Obama support Freedom? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] See the rest here: Pasadena Politics » Does President Obama support Freedom? [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on House Republicans split: Truth vs. Myth by Mnmike</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2009/03/19/house-republicans-split-truth-vs-myth/comment-page-1/#comment-197</link>
		<dc:creator>Mnmike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Mar 2009 22:51:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=91#comment-197</guid>
		<description>They all have a personal agenda. Protect their income and benefits. Then votes, then whats really good for the country.
 Their all crooks for the most part. Lets just pick the least rotten of all the apples at the polls.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They all have a personal agenda. Protect their income and benefits. Then votes, then whats really good for the country.<br />
 Their all crooks for the most part. Lets just pick the least rotten of all the apples at the polls.</p>
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		<title>Comment on If ACTA is so straight forward &#8211; why the secret? by Shannon Riojas</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2009/03/13/if-acta-is-so-straight-forward-why-the-secret/comment-page-1/#comment-196</link>
		<dc:creator>Shannon Riojas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 21:31:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=86#comment-196</guid>
		<description>Various people have named it better as the Cult of Personality.   Between the poor status of education in this nation and the Personality Cult the Media only helps to whip up arround Obama, can you blame people for thinking Bigger Government is the answer.

Critical Thinking is not taught with any conviction if all in High Schools.   Why do you think the great questions went unasked by those who voted: Whose Hope?  Whose Change?  What are they both defined as Mr. Obama?   So long as people blindly send their kids to Government schools, the USA will continue to lose sight of what Freedom really means.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Various people have named it better as the Cult of Personality.   Between the poor status of education in this nation and the Personality Cult the Media only helps to whip up arround Obama, can you blame people for thinking Bigger Government is the answer.</p>
<p>Critical Thinking is not taught with any conviction if all in High Schools.   Why do you think the great questions went unasked by those who voted: Whose Hope?  Whose Change?  What are they both defined as Mr. Obama?   So long as people blindly send their kids to Government schools, the USA will continue to lose sight of what Freedom really means.</p>
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		<title>Comment on If ACTA is so straight forward &#8211; why the secret? by Mnmike</title>
		<link>http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/2009/03/13/if-acta-is-so-straight-forward-why-the-secret/comment-page-1/#comment-195</link>
		<dc:creator>Mnmike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 01:21:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pasadenapolitics.net/?p=86#comment-195</guid>
		<description>Quote.&quot;Where is the Transparency you touted Mr. President?&quot;

Unfortunately the majority in this country that voted him in for no better reason than he&#039;s black or he&#039;s a Democrat will have the wool pulled over their eyes on a couple of issues that Obama elects to have &quot;transparent&quot;. These few issues will be the &quot;promise&quot; he kept, and they will not even care to hear about the countless other issues that we will get blindsided with.
The amount of &quot;crap&quot; coming from the Whitehouse sickens me to no end. How is it, the common person refuses to see that the government is slowly taking over and we will be a socialist country if nothing is done.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Quote.&#8221;Where is the Transparency you touted Mr. President?&#8221;</p>
<p>Unfortunately the majority in this country that voted him in for no better reason than he&#8217;s black or he&#8217;s a Democrat will have the wool pulled over their eyes on a couple of issues that Obama elects to have &#8220;transparent&#8221;. These few issues will be the &#8220;promise&#8221; he kept, and they will not even care to hear about the countless other issues that we will get blindsided with.<br />
The amount of &#8220;crap&#8221; coming from the Whitehouse sickens me to no end. How is it, the common person refuses to see that the government is slowly taking over and we will be a socialist country if nothing is done.</p>
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